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>But I think the idea of relationships having to be a zero-sum-thing is quite common too, and I from my point of view, this way of thinking is an unhealthy mistake, because since humans are different, relationships can have complicated dynamics, and I don't think it's healthy to always trying to "settle the score", always trying to "pay back every debt", positive or negative. This only puts everyone under pressure, and I think we all have enough pressure already.

But that’s exactly my point. This is a sick and demeaning practice of people who are too immature to hold a relationship at all. There is no correlation with monogamy here.

>why should commitment always be exclusive? I mean, you can have more than one child and still be committed to all of your children? You can have more than one friend, and you very probably have (or at least had) more than one parent, and the multiplicity of these relationships doesn't automatically decrease their value, right? The love you feel for someone doesn't have to decrease just because you also feel lvoe for someone else.

Come on, you have to realize that these are apples and oranges. Love for kids, for parents, for pets, for friends, for significant others – these are all completely separate things, and you can’t compare them.

>Are you trying to say poly relationships are only sexual, only about fucking more than one person? I'm sorry, but that's quite a shallow view then.
>I wouldn't call that "hedonism" because having a poly relationship probably doesn't mean you're only skimming the cream off of a bunch of relationships. I guess in a complete relationship, you have to take the downsides as well, good time and bad times. So I don't think a poly relationship is only for the pursue of pleasure.

Okay, maybe I used an oversimplification here. What I have in mind is generally intimate behaviors, such as sex, but also cuddling, kissing, holding hands, certain intimate ways of communication… If we strip these away from a relationship we are left with friendship. True friendship is also a form of love. And there is nothing in friendships that goes against the concept of monogamy.

>Really? I want to remind you that there's this thing called "marriage", and having an unmarried relationship can be a legal (and cultural) hassle at times - that's one reason why people fought for same-sex marriage. So, one way or another, you are kinda pressured into marriage. Also, I guess you might also see marriage as a sign of the exclusive commitment you seem to value so much?
>But then again, being married means that a break-up also includes a divorce. There is a lot of pressure - legal, financial, cultural, societal - standing in the way of ending a marriage, besides the trouble that already comes with a break-up already. So you say you're not forced to stay with incompatible people? Well, I see quite a lot of force there.


Look, I live in a hella conservative country. I’ve been living with my girlfriend for ~2.5 years without marriage now, and I don’t feel any pressure. I mean, those things that you mention are real problems, but not within the first and second world countries. Yes, marriage is a form of commitment, and you do it only when you know you can handle the commitment. Sure, sometimes (even often) it happens that people are too weak to work through downsides of the commitment or that they simply cease to love each other, and they have to go through the inconvenience of a divorce. It’s called a calculated risk. Obviously, divorce is not pleasant, but I wouldn’t call it a factor that forces you to form unbreakable relationships.

>From my experience, for many people "marriage and children" actually is the their ideal of a relationship, and in our society, this is quite well-accepted, while other (maybe more meaningful and healthy?) relationship goals aren't.

But that’s again a personal problem. I’ll stress it again: in our culture before you get married (which you are not obliged to do), you get to know the other person. Therefore you can discuss stuff like whether you want to get married and/or have kids at all. Marriage with children is a natural order which emerged in the human society. I am not saying that it’s right because it’s natural, but it implies that this idea is generally accepted within such a society. You can conform to it, but you do not have to. Sure, when you look around, you’ll probably see more people who want marriage and kids, but imposing a different world view on them would be immoral just like forcing people to marriage, don’t you think?

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